Pushtikul Satsang Mandal
 Username:   Password:  
Save Password   Forget password?  
click to register
     
 All Forums
  Beginners Questions
 Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu & Mahaprabhuji
  Printer Friendly Version
Pages:
       1  |  2  |  3  |  4  |  5      Previous Page | Next Page | Reload
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
kailashks
Entry Level Member


5 Posts
Posted - 23 June 2009 :  17:20:45

Jai Shri Krishna

In Prameyaratnarnava of Lallu Bhattji translated by Shyamdas, it is quoted that "Because of diminishing intellect, this world appears as a. dream and is a source of pain after pain (10.14.22)."

 

quote:
|| Sarvam Krishna Arpanam ||

Jai Shri Krishna !!

Very nice. Thank you

How dumb was I that I always considered that the number of souls is always constant forgetting that the soul itself is a part of the Lord and the Lord can create or merge a soul into himself.

However, this leads to further questions. If soul is a part of the Lord then what is that which undergoes pain in this material world?  For example, when someone behaves in a rude manner, we feel bad. What is that makes us feel bad? Is it the Soul? But soul is a part of God and should be free from all this. Or is that the soul feels all the pain as it is separated from the Lord?

Also, if the soul is a part of God (no doubt it is not as powerful as the Lord) then does it support te concept of non-dualism?



Guru govind dono khade kaake lagu pay, balihari guru ki govind diyo bataye Go to Top of Page
shreekant22
PRO - Pushtikul.com / P.E.M. January 2004


1853 Posts
Posted - 05 July 2009 :  12:13:11

Jai Shree Krishna

A very interesting topic, and am sure, the way it has evolved with Unnatijis apt inputs has been a source of  learning for all of us.



Shree Vallabha dheesh ki jai Go to Top of Page
friendmonu
Mover & Shaker Member


280 Posts
Posted - 05 July 2009 :  14:25:09

Jai Shree Krishna!!

Very well explained by Unnatiji ... feels proud that such  learned vaishnavs are here with us on site!! Pls do spend ur valuable time..



Jai Shree Krishna!!

Regards,

Monica. Go to Top of Page
unnati
Senior Member


224 Posts
Posted - 06 July 2009 :  12:11:34

Jai Jai Shri Gokulesh,

Prakashji, I'm really sorry cudn't reply u earlier as was a lil bit busy wid other committments. Shreekantji n Monicaji, thanx for those kind words but it wud be more appreciated if u both share part of ur knowledge on this topic.

However, this leads to further questions. If soul is a part of the Lord then what is that which undergoes pain in this material world?  For example, when someone behaves in a rude manner, we feel bad. What is that makes us feel bad? Is it the Soul? But soul is a part of God and should be free from all this. Or is that the soul feels all the pain as it is separated from the Lord?

Prakashji, please have a look on this...

Shri Mahaprabhuji has explained this in one of his work i.e. "Sarvanirnaya Nibandh" (183/184).

" Aatmaiva Tadidam Sarvam Srujati Prabhu: I
Trayate Trati Vishvatma Hruyate Hartishvar: I
Aatmaiv Tadidam Sarvam Brahmaiva Tadidam Tatha I
Iti Shrutyarthamadaya Sadhyam Sarvaiyarthamati: I
Ayamav Brahmavad: Shishtam Mohay Kalpitam II "

Meaning:

Here, Everything is parmatma. Whatever worldly object is seen is emerged out of Brahma, he is the Material and Efficient cause of the world. He is the Generator, Operator and Destroyer of the world. This sort of view is known as brahmavada, rest all views are not true as it simply Illusion.

The most important aspect of the Ultimate Reality is that it is one and without a second, He is infinite and all comprehensive. The diverse names and forms to be found in this universe are but the manifestations of the self same Ultimate Entity. In other words that One Ultimate Entity has become Many. The powers of this Ultimate Reality are simply in comprehensible, and one peculiar charateristic of this aspect is the fact that even the mutually conflicting qualities can reside together in it. This Ultimate Reality is endowed with all divine qualities. In other words, it is not attribute less as some may think. The Ultimate Reality is both personal and impersonal, and the personal aspect repeatedly incarnates itself. All this activity is only a sport on the part of this Ultimate Reality.

Jivas are Amsas or parts of God. They issue from Brahman spontaneously as sparks from fire. Brahman is the whole. The Jiva or the individual soul is part; but, there is no real difference between Brahman and the individual soul, because the individual soul is of identical essence with Brahman. The individual soul is not Brahman screened by the veil of Avidya. It is itself Brahman, with the attribute ‘bliss’ being obscured or suppressed. Ananda or bliss is suppressed or obscured in the individual soul. Ananda and consciousness are suppressed or obscured in matter or the non-living world. When the soul attains bliss, and the inanimate world attains both consciousness and bliss, the difference between Brahman and these vanishes.

Brahma is an inseparable Material Cause(Upadan Karan) and Efficient Cause(Nimmit Karan) of the world. It is the menifestation of Brahma in the form of JIVA and inert element during the time when world comes to an end. His attributes becomes concelled. Brahma as a Material cause of the world assumes any form by His will and for His "LILA" or playful pastimes in his LILA every object has a purpose to serve His will.

This world in its myriad objects is a divine play of Brahma, the GOD. Brahma manifests HIMSELF by HIS own will as Cause (karan) and Effect (karya). But the effect is not different from cause. Only it is known by a different name. The creative activity belongs to Brahma. He reveals this world out of himself and for His own sport by His will.

Brahma is all powerful i.e. "Kartum Akartum Anyatha Kartum".

Meaning: He can do, He can undo and He can do otherwise also.



Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....

Unnati Kadakia

 

Go to Top of Page
prakash_kotecha
Junior Member


61 Posts
Posted - 06 July 2009 :  12:29:32
|| Sarvam Krishna Arpanam ||

Jai Shri Krishna !!

Unnatiji, Thank you very much.

I really appreciate the efforts that you put in giving such an elaborate explanation. However, I should add that sometimes things are so complex that it goes over my head. I wish I am some day able to understand all this.

Thank you very much

Regards
Prakash Go to Top of Page
unnati
Senior Member


224 Posts
Posted - 07 July 2009 :  11:32:13

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Yes ofcourse u will understand all this n will be able to explain others when they r confused...

U can Plz continue to ask if things r complex n i hope someone else cud try to make u understand in a more lucid way..



Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....

Unnati Kadakia

 

Go to Top of Page
prakash_kotecha
Junior Member


61 Posts
Posted - 07 July 2009 :  11:39:09
|| Sarvam Krishna ARpanam ||

Jai Shri Krishna !!

:)

I do not think there will be a more lucid way of explaining than you do. It is just that I need to "grow up"

Thank you very much

Regards
Prakash Go to Top of Page
sital
Entry Level Member


18 Posts
Posted - 08 July 2009 :  16:41:29

Jai Shree Krishna

 

 

Prakashji I know what you mean, I always find it difficult to comprehend our lovely scriptures.  Hence I listen to Je Je’ vachnamruts, they say with your guru’s grace it becomes easy to understand.

 

 

Co-incidentally this was discussed by Shree Dwarkeshbava in his Bhagvat Katha.  Aapshri mentioned that this material world is Thakorji’s playground; we are all actors and actresses meant to play our role.   Now instead of playing our role’s we start thinking it to be the reality.  Like when you’re watching TV and a sad scene comes on, you become teary, why?  Because for a few minutes you are forgetting that is a program and all the people in there are only acting. Same with us, we forget to pray and run after our sansaar, consider it to be our ultimate goal, forgetting that we are only here temporary just acting our role.  That’s why we experience pain and disappointments. Jagat is the truth but our sansaar is an illusion.

 

 

JSK

 



Go to Top of Page
prakash_kotecha
Junior Member


61 Posts
Posted - 08 July 2009 :  16:48:08
|| Sarvam Krishna Arpanam ||

Jai Shri Krishna !!

It is nice to know to that I am not the only confused soul. Thanks for the encouragement. The TV example was very cool.

Still I dont understand why the Lord creates the world, lets adharma grow in the world, comes to annihilate it and the whole cycle repeats. Why is that he cant stop himself from creating the world and enjoy the bliss in Shrimati Radharani. Why is that he creates the world for pasttime?

I have seen in BR Chopras Mahabharat (during the Gita upadesh) where the Lord says he creates the world so that people dont blame him for running away from his duty. But still if he doesnt create, the questions from people dont arise.

Regards
Prakash Go to Top of Page
sital
Entry Level Member


18 Posts
Posted - 08 July 2009 :  19:51:07

Jai Shree Krishna

 

 

Snap, I always used to ponder over this question too.

 

 

He has Virudhabhasya element in him, which means that he encompasses elements of the opposite nature.  Just as Dharma is within Him so is Adharma, Would it be fair if He only lets His element of Dharma play in the Drama and ignore Adharma ?  Would Adharm be right for his blissful play with Shree Svaminiji?

 

 

Yes he enjoys the bliss with Shree Svaminiji but his swaroop has many other elements, which were probably not suitable for the blissful play, hence became part of the material play.   It was Svaminji’s decision to have many more player in the field as she wanted to make this drama more interesting.   

 

 

Shastra also explains ekohum Bahusyam: that Shree Krishna was one and became many, souls are parts and parcels of Shree Krishna. All souls are created directly or indirectly from his Shree Ang (Body). So in theory there is nothing else but Shree Krishna, he resides within everybody, be it a tree, flower, animal or Human being. To create a play he gave everybody different identities and free will. Without his grace we would not be able to talk, walk, speak and carry out all the other various activities.

 

 

So in reality it’s all Him there are no individual entities who are really getting hurt or killed.  When you have so many qualities within, would you not like to use them for a game? There is pleasure in pain and separation as well

 

 

Sorry I am just waffling on,  please let me know your views

 

 

JSK

 



Go to Top of Page
Topic is 5 Pages Long:
       1  |  2  |  3  |  4  |  5      Previous Page | Next Page | Reload
 
Jump To:


Set as your default homepage Add favorite Privacy Report A Problem/Issue   2014 Pushtikul Satsang Mandal All Rights Reserved. Pushtikul.com Contact Us Go To Top Of Page

loaded in 0.438s